Threads from Henry's Web

Tag: creationism

  • Convincing Yourself of Falsehood

    . . . or perhaps of less than complete truth.

    Some years ago when I was in the Air Force I had a roommate who was an excellent software engineer. At the time I was a serious hobbyist programmer, so occasionally we would work together on projects. I remember a case in which he had a routine that would work when run under the debugger but would hang when run normally. After checking all the options either of us could think of, he could not conceive of any reason why it would do so.

    At this point, being more ignorant, and thus less certain that all the bases were covered, I suggested putting a delay into the routine at that point (I believe we used something like 1/100th of a second eventually). He didn’t want to do it at first, largely because it would solve the problem (if it worked) without actually discovering what the real problem was. Finally he did try it, it worked, and he released the code in that form, because he never did find anything.

    Now the point isn’t that I was a better programmer; I wasn’t. It’s not that I was more clever; I’m not. It’s simply that, lacking the ability to check off all the boxes I had to try some considerably less logical options, one of which worked.

    It’s very easy to convince ourselves that we have covered all the bases on a subject, or that the evidence for something we believe in very fervently is much stronger than it is. In fact, I suspect that the single most common reason why people accept a particular piece of evidence as reliable is that it supports a conclusion they like.

    I mention this because of a discussion about lying in science and other matters. Larry B made an interesting comment here, and expanded on it over at Quintessence of Dust.

    This all reminded me about a comment a political science professor once made to me when discussing conspiracy theories. “Never attribute to conspiracy what can adequately be explained by human stupidity.” I think he got that from someone else, but I’m not sure who. After reconsidering all this material, I might just paraphrase that to “Never attribute to lying any statement that can be explained by stupidity and/or the overwhelming desire to believe.”

    Perhaps Dr. Matheson’s term “folk science” is the best term after all.

  • Blogroll: Geocreationism.com

    Having decided to blog a couple of times per week about my blogroll, I’m going to start with a site I just added, Geocreationism.com. If you’ve been following this blog for any period of time, you will have noticed occasional comments from Geocreationist, and this is his blog.

    I have a couple of reasons for including it. First, he disagree with a number of positions I take, but is open to dialog. That’s an excellent start. Second, his position on creation and evolution illustrates one of my key contentions: This is not a black and white issue in which there are only two sides. One of the defining features of the moderate position, as I see it, is refusing to be held to a choice of extremes. That’s why moderates are frequently very annoying to extremists–we refuse to get stuck with only two options. Sometimes even if you give us A, B, C, and D, we want E-none of the above.

    Before I go to a particular post, let me look at Geocreationism’s subtitle: Geocreationism – Showing harmony between mainstream science and scripture. It’s very easy to forget that when we look at the interaction between science and scripture that both sides can vary. One can differ on a view of science or of a particular scientific theory, or one can differ on the interpretation of scripture. Any type of reconciliation or harmony involves both. This subtitle is one I would not use, for example, because I don’t think there is any need for harmony simply because I don’t believe science and scripture address the same questions. There are occasional overlaps, but these are incidental, I think. This is one of the issues for Christians. Just what is scripture trying to address, and in what way does it address it?

    We’ll see some of this in action in a recent post, “Evidence for Creation” (Review) – Ground Rules for the Review. Geocreationist is reviewing Tom DeRosa’s book Evidence for Creation – Intelligent Answers for Open Minds. In laying out his own ground rules he distinguishes what he calls “Darwinian evolution” and “Theistic Evolution.” He defines Darwinian evolution as largely equivalent to atheistic evolution, though he sees little difference between that and the various deistic views.

    He contrasts theistic evolution, in which he says that God not only starts everything, but “He started every wave of Evolution as well.” In his view, God is still distant in this view of theistic evolution, and thus he presents his own third view: geocreationism, or geocreationist theistic evolution. In this case, God is continually present and concerned. I’ll have to read more to see how this impacts the process along the way.

    Now I must say that this terminology is somewhat surprising to me. For example, evolution occurring in waves with God starting each wave sounds very much like old earth creationism to me. Further, Geocreationist describes his view in this way: “Evolution would occur with our without the randomness, as long as God remains involved; remove God however, and the randomness would not be enough.” That latter view sounds somewhat like ID or “guided evolution” to me, depending on how one fills in the details.

    If I’m reading all of this correctly, I’m going to fall into the “Darwinian evolution” camp. My problem with being placed there is that I don’t think God is distant. For each and every law of nature I believe we can say it happens “because God.” In other words God wills gravity, and should he stop willing it, there would be no gravity. Not to worry, however, he’s pretty fond of gravity. God also wills variation and natural selection, and those produce certain types of order according to that law. Remove God and you remove everything.

    Now I know that there are some views that allow for indetectible divine intervention, but I’m not particularly interested at the moment in things that are even theoretically indetectible. I believe that God creates the laws, i.e. the system, which in turn produces everything that we see. God can intervene, but he would do so because he wants to, primarily because he wants to communicate with these weird creatures who have come into being.

    I have one further comment initial comment. Geocreationist appears to be looking for at least an historical outline in the Genesis accounts. I think this is doomed to be a disappointing search in the long run. I do not believe that the literature involved was written with the intent to provide a narrative history of anything, but rather to express God’s relationship to creation using the cosmology and symbolic language of the time. I will blog more on it as time goes on, but I have found that everything tends to fit quite nicely when read in that context.

  • Differences of Opinion, Lies, and Seeing the Other Side

    I got started this morning on this topic by reading this post at Quintessence of Dust. Dr. Matheson is looking for a good model to use in referring to creationists and their arguments. The temptation is to regard all false statements as lies. But at the same time we have to ask why people who are otherwise honest, and doubtless wouldn’t cheat on tests or steal from their neighbors nonetheless would say so many things that are simply not so.

    Matheson is looks at the model of folk science. I left a comment on his blog in which I question just how well this works. But I’m working on this one myself. I have to ask myself how a microbiologist, for example, could manage to believe in creationism. There is always Kurt Wise (paleontologist), who admits the strong evidence for evolution, but believes that the Bible must be true, and thus no matter what the evidence looks like, eventually he’ll find the proper evidence for young age arguments. Now I can at least understand the mental process in Dr. Wise’s case, though it still astounds me that one could look at the strength of the evidence and study it as a paleontologist and still come out not just a creationist, but a young earth creationist.

    I had already bookmarked his post for a link, if not a substantial response, when I came across this article (HT: It seems to me ….) In a weird sort of way, this article is making a point similar to what Dr. Matheson is making, though perhaps with greater humor and less finesse–there are some beliefs and viewpoints that are comforting to us, and we cling to any means by which we can avoid losing those beliefs.

    I think it’s quite possible that many creationists simply cannot imagine a world in which man is not a separate creation, especially put here by God with a unique and special relationship. It is quite possible that their lives would lose meaning–or at least they feel viscerally that they would–should any element of this prove wrong. If one’s identity is at stake, just how much might one be able to rationalize?

    Just as I was preparing to write this post, I found this post on Pharyngula, in which the Discovery Institute is shown to have taken e-mails out of context (gasp!) regarding the Gonzalez case as ISU. Here, of course, we have a greater level of interpretation involved, but it still is hard to see how the DI got what they did from their source. Liars? Good PR men? Different point of view?

    And immediately after that one, my RSS reader turned up another one, titled Gene Duplication and the GENE project’s … Duplicity?. Again, the author, generally a very polite man and one I respect after reading quite a number of his substantial blog entries, is having trouble finding out just what you call it. ICR is gathering scientists to study the genome, and their going to conclude–you guessed it–that humanity is not related to the other animals. And they haven’t even started yet!

    Now I know that it is very easy to regard a difference of opinion as good evidence of skullduggery on the part of one’s opponent. Sometimes opinions are simply so different that it’s hard for us to imagine that the other guy can possibly have good motivations or can be honest. After all, we know that we are careful with the facts, and our brains are all highly logical. So if we come to conclusion A, and they come to conclusion Z, it can’t be a legitimate difference of opinion–it has to result from questionable morals.

    Of course, sometimes things are what they appear to be on the surface. Not always, perhaps not even frequently, but sometimes. There are people who hold a particular position to keep their power, or because they just can’t admit to having been wrong. But I think there are relatively few people who consciously say, “I know that X is true, but I’m going to say I believe Y instead.” Whatever the motivation, one is going to think of it in some very different way. Which leads us to this question: Is it a lie if the person telling it deceived himself first, and believes he’s telling the truth? I do know one thing–if a person believes he’s telling the truth, it will be hard to influence him by telling him he’s actually a liar. “Truthful” is part of his self-image.

    I would say something to creationists, however. I once was one of you. I made it about half way through college. When I was a child, I started collecting creationist books and reading them. I was totally convinced that evolution was not only evil but stupid, so stupid, in fact, that only evil people could possibly believe it. To me, as is still the case for many creationists, evolutionists were great liars and conspirators, since the truth that God created the earth in a literal week 6,000 years ago was so plain.

    Now I first encountered the problems with the facts when I looked at Biblical genealogies. In doing so, I spent enough time with ancient chronology to see that the hardline young earth position, about 6,000 years (not 10,000!) was in conflict not only with geology, but with archeology, and even with written history. Civilizations would have drowned in the flood, civilizations that had clearly done no such thing.

    But then I was faced with the science side. Now I spend a great deal of time reading popular level science. But I’m a high school dropout, so I never had high school science. I took a GED test and took as little science in college as I could get by with, which turned out to be one year of chemistry. My college allowed one to make it up with math, which I did. So when I first started, the vast majority of the “science” I knew came from those young earth creationist books. How was I to judge the material?

    Well, I concluded I wasn’t very qualified to do so. What I was qualified to do was to see how well creationists represented evolution. What I found out there was that the presentation of evolution in creationist books bore no resemblance to the presentation in books favoring evolution. They were, in fact, talking about two things. Further, when creationists quoted scientists, they generally got the quotation wrong. For me, that was pretty substantial evidence that there was a problem in the creationist camp.

    Since then, I’ve found nothing to suggest to me any differently. One of the best arguments against creationism for the layman (in scientific terms) is that the creationists can’t get their facts straight about evolution. I personally think Dr. Matheson is right, and they don’t do so because they’re congenital liars, but rather because they’re engaging in some form of “folk science.” Or perhaps it’s Santaism as defined in the Ship of Fools article.

    Bottom line: differences of opinion, lies, and failure to see the other side? It’s damn hard to tell the difference!

  • A Note on Evolution, ID, and Ethical Behavior

    No, this isn’t going to be an extended discussion of the ethics of intelligent design advocates, though one of their number does come into it.

    One of the frequent charges made against evolutionary theory is that it undermines the basis for morals. Various anti-evolutionists have blamed evolutionary theory for everything from the holocaust to bad behavior in schools. It’s interesting that the only people who are saying that if evolution is true there is no basis for morality are the anti-evolutionists themselves, and thus they would have only themselves to blame if some young people took it to heart.

    I saw this kind of argument again today when I read a portion of the Kitzmiller v. Dover transcript (HT: Austringer, who actually quotes two more examples than I do). I normally don’t have the patience to read trial transcripts, and so tend to read other people’s summaries. But this section isn’t all that long and I think it will help make a couple of points about how ethical behavior is driven.

    First, however, I must mention the interesting ethical question of continuing to claim that the Foundation for Thought and Ethics didn’t get its day in court. Given a substantial record indicating the contrary, one wonders if that can be regarded as either thoughtful or ethical. (Such appears to be the activities of the Discovery Institute blog.)

    The following is a quotation from the testimony of Jon Buell, president of the Foundation for Thought and Ethics. Eric Rothschild (Q) is cross-examining.

    Q And then if you go over to the next page, in the first paragraph, you blame — you blame the current deplorable condition of our schools resulting in large part in denying the dignity of man created in God’s image, correct?

    A Yes, correct.

    Q And the rest of the paragraph builds on that concept, right?

    A That’s right. Many teachers tell me they have difficulty with — in the classroom with student behavior because there is no — there’s no sense of respect or accountability to the teacher, to the school, or to authority.

    Q And effectively what you’re advocating in this fundraising letter is that the FTE’s publications are an antidote or a partial antidote to these problems of hostility to Christian views and the cultural decay in our schools, isn’t that right?

    A I would say that they’re not an antidote to the hostility to Christian views, but they are an antidote to the hostility toward positive character qualities and moral traits and a positive outlook and philosophy.

    Now what I see there is a claim that cultural decay results from the teaching of the things that the FTE opposes, particularly in Of Pandas and People, and that this creates hostility toward positive character qualities and moral traits, and even against a positive outlook and philosophy. The mere notion that human beings are descended from a common ancestor with apes is so powerful that it will accomplish all of that.

    Two things come to my mind in response.

    The first is the Christian doctrine of total depravity. In general, Christians have not taught that good people are produced by a proper understanding of the universe, but rather that this is accomplished by the grace of God. There are innumerable major and minor variations on this theme, but the doctrine of total depravity basically says that humankind is fallen, unable to do anything of and for themselves of a morally positive nature.

    So exactly how is total depravity worse than common descent in terms of producing a hopeless attitude? Common descent does not even suggest that we are morally hopeless, but rather than we come from a morally neutral background in which our ancestors behaved as beasts, presumably in the way proper to their species and situation. We come to the point of ethical decision making at the same time when we take on whatever distinctive characteristics make us moral creatures.

    Total depravity tells us that we are, in fact, worthless–on our own. Now of course the goal is to make us come to God and be redeemed. But that is precisely my point. Christianity doesn’t preach the redemption of the really good people who understand that they were designed for moral behavior, but rather for fallen people who are doomed to moral failure.

    Which of these views gives the higher place to humanity? Which is more likely to produce moral people? Actually I see little reason to believe either one has a major impact. But if one can argue that evolution has an impact (I do not), then one can also argue that the doctrine of total depravity would have such an impact.

    Christians, as believers in redemption, should have no difficulty working within a context in which redemption is necessary. It does not matter if one was previously dirt being formed by the hand of God into a shape, or if one was an ancestral form of animal behaving according to its character. What matter is what one is now.

    But that leads me to ask just what is the primary motivation to bad behavior? I think that is demonstrated within this transcript. As humans we choose to regulate our behavior as part of societies. But we all have things that we truly desire. The question is generally whether our ethics will regulate the way we behave in order to achieve our desires. Can we deny ourselves a desired goal because the process required to get it is wrong, however we come to the conclusion that it is wrong?

    Well, the same section of trial transcript suggests that belief in intelligent design does not preclude taking the less ethical pathway. The desire of the defendants, and of the Foundation for Thought and Ethics was to have intelligent design taught in schools. FTE produced a textbook for that purpose. The Dover Area School Board acted for that purpose. In order to accomplish that goal, intelligent design must not be seen as religious. If it was found to be a religious idea, it would be rejected.

    The only ethical way to get a religious idea into American public school classrooms would be to change the constitution. Not that I’m suggesting such a thing be done. But coming out openly and saying, “We want to promote Christianity in public schools. The establishment clause is in our way. Let’s get rid of the establishment clause,” would be ethical, however inadvisable. People could get a look at just what the ID advocates wanted. (Note that not all ID advocates want this. My comments here refer specifically to those trying to introduce ID into public school classrooms.)

    In cross-examination, again, Eric Rothschild brought up five sources that indicate that FTE had as its purpose the promotion of Christian thought. I’m just going to quote three of them:

    1. The from 990

      Q And the explanation that the Foundation provides to the IRS is that its primary exempt purpose is promoting and publishing textbooks presenting a Christian perspective, isn’t that right?

      A That’s what it says.

      Q Okay. And Pandas is one of those publications, isn’t it?

      A No, Pandas doesn’t fit this because this is not an accurate statement.
      [the quotation begins on page 84, line 12]

      So either the form 990 was falsified, or Of Pandas and People has a different purpose than the one stated.

    2. Then the corporate charter:

      Q If you go to the third page of the document, it identifies the purposes for the — for which the corporation1 was formed?

      A Right.

      Q And what it states is that the primary purpose is both religious and educational, and then it talks about making known the Christian gospel and understanding of the Bible?

      A Yes.

      Q Is it your testimony that that’s also an inaccurate submission?

      A It was boilerplate that the attorney that was helping us become established used. I felt that it was inappropriate. He said we need to be clear in identifying yourself as having a genuine nonprofit purpose, and so the language that originated with me is the phrase, “but is not limited to.”

      Q And everything else was the attorney’s?

      A Yes, most of it, I think nearly all of it, possibly all of it.
      [the quotation begins on page 85, line 24]

      In this case we appear to have a goal–formation of a non-profit–and it is therefore OK, even for an organization named “Foundation for Thought and Ethics” to just use the boilerplate. Apparently identifying their actual activities wouldn’t do.

      In fact, I have no doubt that the religious purpose was truthful, and it became inconvenient later. The problem is that either the document must be false, or the testimony about the document must be false. There’s some lying involved here somewhere.

      I am also fairly certain that nobody is so careless as to late a completely incorrect statement of purpose go through in a corporate charter. Normally you would get something you can live with. I may be optimistic about human nature, however.

    3. The organization’s web site:

      Q Mr. Buell, this document is something that was1 pulled off the Internet, but you recognize it as a purpose statement for the Foundation that used to be distributed?

      A Yes. I don’t actually — I don’t actually remember this statement, but it’s obviously an FTE statement.

      Q And in this statement it says, “The Foundation for Thought and Ethics has been established to introduce Biblical perspective into the mainstream of America’s humanistic society, confronting the secular thought of modern man with the truth of God’s word.”

      A Yes, that’s right.

      Q And then it talks about how there would be a public — a textbook published which will present the scientific evidence for creation side by side with evolution.

      A Yes, and this, by the way, was written before — I can just tell from the language, this was very early, before the National Academy defined the term creation science. So the terms of art that are in play today were not in existence at that time.

      Q This was just your use of the word creation?

      A Yes, right.

      Q And into the third paragraph it describes the Foundation as a Christian think tank, correct?

      A Yes. I would say in contrast to that, there’s what we’ve done for over 25 years, which is not to be a Christian think tank, but to actually engage in primary works of science.

      Q And that includes Pandas, correct?

      A It includes Pandas, yes.

      And there we have it. What they’ve announced that they have done for all those years is not what they have actually been doing. There is some extremely disingenuous work with the definition of creationism–the National Academy of Sciences doesn’t really have the power to control definitions–but that would require more writing.

    Conclusion: It is more important to accomplish the purpose–getting ID into public schools–than it is to be truthful about the purpose of one’s organization.

    This shows, I think what is the primary challenge to ethical behavior, and its not evolution. It is the attitude that says that if we have a goal we regard as desirable we can take any means necessary to accomplish that goal. In this case that manifests itself by the denial that an organization is actually pursuing Christian values.

    But it manifests itself also in the claim that evolution results in all kinds of behavioral and moral problems. This claim is made in opposition to evolutionary theory–we shouldn’t teach it because it causes deteriorating morals. But the effect of a fact does not impact the truth of that fact.

    To be quite honest I’d rather evolution weren’t true either. I like to preach about a loving God, and it would be much nicer to be able to show a really cuddly process of creation, a loving God carefully crafting creatures and not allowing them to fight it out. But my desire does not change the facts. And there are good points about the facts as well. A less hands-on, saccharine God, though perhaps not my first choice may be a better choice. But it still doesn’t matter. What is, is.

    By attempting to argue against evolution based on the way it makes people feel, anti-evolutionists fall directly into this same trap. That which they desire to be true, must be true. But of course reality rolls blithely on, unconcerned with their desires, and people of integrity want to know what actually is, not what they wish.

  • A Taste of Teaching the Controversy

    “Teach the controversy” is one of the well-worn slogans of the creationist movement, and has been well used in the controversy about intelligent design (ID). It’s power is in an appeal to fairness. There’s a dispute? Teach both sides. What could be fairer than that?

    As with most slogans the problems occur in practically every word. What is “the” controversy? What are the “weaknesses” of evolutionary theory that one should teach? And even more importantly, what does it mean to teach a controversy?

    I would suggest that in order to actually teach something, the instructor needs to take the students through a process of evaluation, of weighing and testing the evidence provided. If that controversy is ID vs the theory of evolution, such a weighing and testing will result in a negative evaluation of ID–unless, of course, one tries to privilege certain ideas over others.

    This is not the type of “teaching the controversy” that is desired by ID proponents. In general, they are asking that their views, though representing those of a very small minority of the scientific community, should be taught alongside evolution as having equal validity. The attempt to get these materials into public schools is simply an end-run around the process of science, and indeed of scholarship in general. What ID advocates are asking is that ideas that have been rejected by the vast majority of the scientific community should be presented instead to high school students for their evaluation.

    I can understand this desire. It’s always fun to take your material to an audience that will not be qualified to challenge you seriously on facts or logic. But it’s not the proper place to get ideas evaluated.

    We have just seen an example of “teaching the controversy”, and doing it well, on NOVA, and the ID folks don’t particularly like it. (The complaints about “Inherit the Wind” footage are particularly humorous.)

    Well, I’m not surprised. They didn’t actually want the whole controversy taught. They didn’t want all their claims evaluated. They just hoped they would be presented side by side to unsuspecting high school students who do not yet have the knowledge to evaluate what they are hearing.

    There are reasons why ID is presented to popular audiences rather than scientific ones. 1) Doing the actual science is too hard, or perhaps 2) The advocates know that no matter how hard they work, the evidence just isn’t there, or 3) They don’t actually care about science at all, and they’re just trying to make points in the culture wars. Come to think of it, it could be all of the above.

    But this argument does not only apply to ID. In the public school science program, we need to teach science, and we need to have some basis on which to decide what is and is not science. Any minority viewpoint can hire PR firms and try to get itself treated as science through the political process, but that is not a good way to determine what really is science. I suggest one standard: Consensus science. There is plenty of that to fill the science curriculum. Other ideas may apply, but the process goes through the scientific community for publication, testing, and verification.

    I would add one more note on this. I have commented before on the NCBCPS Bible curriculum which is aimed at public schools. Many Christians see this as a wonderful opportunity to restore Biblical literacy. But they need to think again. Just how is it that the Bible can properly be taught in public schools? It will have to be taught as an academic subject, which means that the historicity of certain stories, such as the exodus, the destruction of Jericho, or similar things, should be evaluated in a scholarly fashion, as objectively as possible.

    That requires, amongst other things, qualified instructors, and good curriculum (NCBCPS isn’t good curriculum). This will be Bible as a secular topic. Now I wouldn’t mind such a class. The reason I still oppose putting this in public schools is that I believe it inappropriately privileges my own sacred book over that of others and that it is extremely unlikely that we will find appropriately qualified teachers for a sound, academic course on the Bible at the High School level.

    I know, for example, that if I were to teach such a course, many fundamentalist and conservative evangelical students and parents would be shocked at what I would say, though I would be able to point to a great deal of scholarship in all of it. You see, I would “teach the controversy” about many of these subjects, evaluating the evidence, and some people would not be happy with the results.

    Perhaps in High School classes we should teach the most important elements of a subject (and make no mistake, evolution is one of these), and leave the myriad of controversies that people can cook up to be settled through examination by qualified persons.

  • Mixed Emotions about Sweden

    I read this news article from Sweden with mixed emotions (HT: Panda’s Thumb).

    My first reaction is negative. Since these schools are faith based, it seems appropriate to me that they teach from the perspective of the faith involved in sponsoring the school. I relate this to my own experience being home schooled and being taught creationism. At the end of High School, my grades and test scores were substantially above average, and I know many home schooled or Christian schooled kids who have a similar experience.

    Personally I would prefer to have gotten down to learning what evolution actually was earlier. It would have saved me some time exploring this on my own, but in general, I would prefer to leave such choices to parents, as long as the children in question are able to pass the appropriate tests. I prefer directing education through the requirements for standardized testing or for admission to the next level, rather than prescribing a curriculum in faith-related schools.

    But there is actually the real question. Sweden’s schools are not organized like American schools apparently. The schools in question are funded by the state even though they are faith based. This triggers the other side of my mixed emotions. If the taxpayers need to pay for it, then the state should control the content. All church related schools, as well as my home schooling, were entirely funded by my parents, the same parents who chose to teach me creationism. They chose it; they paid for it.

    I also should emphasize that I believe the correct choice in using public money to fund education at the elementary or high school level is to use that money to teach consensus science, and that means evolutionary theory, and no brand of [tag]creationism[/tag], including ID.

    I’m not certain if there are non-state funded schools in Sweden that would not be subject to this mandate or if all schools are state funded in one way or another. That’s an interesting question for further research.

    Americans should be careful in reading this story and blog reactions to it, because it does not reflect our situation in terms of either funding or the general structure of our educational system.